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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:38 pm 
Ok guys I have had this thing for a little while and it is really starting to become a pain. It takes forever to get started. The carb is running fuel down to the cylinder and the coil is giving it some spark. I have a new NGK-R plug in the thing too. What else can I do? I have tilted the thing so that gas runs out of the overflow tube before kicking, I have tried holding the throttle in different positions if I didn't tilt the bike. Still takes a good ten minutes to start. This thing has higher comp piston and is left hand kick, so it is a pain to kick three good times in a row. Is there some sort of hi output coil or something that I can out on? When I called the Honda shop they said that if I can see the fire in the daylight that the coil was fine. I am getting desperate and if this thing doesn't get better then I am probably just going to trade it for something else. Everytime I kick it I make sure that the piston is TDC. There is a place that makes a compression valve that you can add on. Would that make a big enough difference? Can you actually start a dirtbike while the valve is open or is it just something to help you get the cylinder primed? I have even welded on an extra inch and a half on the kickstart to get a better kick out of it. I am at the end of my rope. Anybody want a CR480R :x


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:58 pm 
Would one of these coils work? They also have plug wires too, but without the coil I guess its pointless. My coil only has one wire running in and then is grounded to the frame of the body. What OHM coil do I have?

http://www.mxsouth.com/nology/nolprofir.htm


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:10 pm 
Sounds like a jetting issue to me.

I am betting the pilot (slow) jet is clogged. Don't bother trying to clean it, replace it. While you are at it, give the carb a good cleaning with carb solvent and compressed air. You didn't say if the bike was an 82 or 83. I am guessing 82 because you welded an extension on the kicker(82 steel, 83 aluminum).

Put a 68 pilot in it if it is an 82, use a 72 for the 83.

Here are the other specs: Main 178-175, Airscrew 1.5 turns out, needle 28K position 3.

Remember, it only needs 3 things to run. Compression (over 120 lbs), fuel, spark.


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 Post subject: re:hard starting
PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:47 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:44 am
Posts: 8
Location: Maysville, AR
other things to check for,chipped or deformed reed petals and leaking crank seals.bad reeds alone can cause hard starting and if the crank seals leak it will be hard to start and run poorly both.good luck.

_________________
1974 Mt 250 elsinore-my first elsinore
1975 CR250M1 Elsinore
1979 CR250R Elsinore
1971 yamaha RT1 360 mx


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 12:05 am 
What is the easiest way to tell if the seals are leaking? The motor never leaks oil at all from anywhere. The top end has been rebuilt and the carb was just went through. It has started to run kind of funky after racing my neighbor. What octane gas should be run through it? I used the cheap stuff since high octane is killer around here. Any other ideas? I'll take the carb out tomm and look through it to check the jet. Will the Honda dealer still have the jet in stock? This is similar to the jets in a four barrel carb right?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:12 pm
Posts: 1
First, buy a shop manual. There are several on Ebay right now.

The seals don't leak oil. They prevent air leaks into the crankcase. The manuals will detail how to do a leakdown test. You will need the proper tools to do it.

NO, the dealer will probably not have the jets in stock. At least none I frequent have them. Yes, they SHOULD have them, but most of their mechanics wouldn't be able to jet a bike properly anyway. But they can be ordered and received in a few days.

You should be running premium gas of at least 91 octane.

Remember, the 480 is a RACE bike, not a trail bike. It needs to be properly maintained in order to perform correctly. That means the factory knew what they were doing when they put it together 20+ years ago. If you get it back to original factory specs (having gaskets and seals that are fresh, jetting that is correct, timing that is correct) the bike will run properly. It is much more sensitive than an auto in this regard.

Good luck.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:07 pm 
The top end on the dirtbike has all been rebuilt, I just got the receipt from the previous owner in the mail today. The carb had been completely gone through and I think (hope) that maybe its something else. Then again if the Honda shop doesn't know what they are doing, this could be a big problem. I ordered a shop manual from ebay so it should be here soon. The previous owner claimed that he bought it with a rebuilt motor, and I dont doubt that part. I worry about the person that actually rebuilt the motor. The previous owner had the old parts that had come out of the motor but said that it was always hard to get started so I think that maybe it is just something small that is keeping it off. I also looked at the carb today and the air screw was off by at least two rounds. Hopefully this accounts for some of the trouble.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 11:30 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 10:20 pm
Posts: 185
Location: San Clemente, CA
The jetting for both the 1982 and 1983 Honda CR480R is published in this forum some threads back. If you do not know the history of the bike, I would suggest that you spring for a fresh float valve and seat, needle and needle jet, and main jet. It may save you time and money in the long run. These parts are available from your dealer or http://www.sudco.com. Then set the carb back to stock - including the float height - as a baseline to work from.

If your primary drive crank seal is leaking the bike will smoke as the engine burns transmission oil, if the rotor side is leaking the bike will idle real fast as it sucks air in. In both cases it will be pretty obvious.

Your kickstart extension is a good idea. There is a CR480R owner from San Diego selling replacement kickers on eBay for these bikes that are a bit longer for a better kick. I assume your are standing on the left-hand side and getting a good long kick with your right leg..? I have even seen the CR480R racers get up on a bike stand to get a better swing.

Send me an email if you need a manual....

_________________
Michael Stiles
AHRMA, CalVMX and SVRG #190
Honda CR250R Elsinore 1979
Honda CR480R 1983
Honda CR250R 1987


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:59 pm 
The motor does smoke some when its running. However, I am running the motor a little rich since it had just been rebuilt. I switched over to running the exact spec oil mixture. Where is the tranny fliud located at and how do I check it? I assume that it has a drain plug and you just check to see if it has any in the case. Is this correct? Is there any discoloration or burning to look for in the fluid?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:33 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 10:20 pm
Posts: 185
Location: San Clemente, CA
It sounds like you need a manual. Send me an email and I can get you a scanned version of the Honda CR480R 1982/1983 manual that I have.

There is a filler for the transmission at the front of the motor on the left-hand side. Warm the bike up, drain the old oil out and re-fill until the level touches the base of the threads where the filler cap goes. Use SAE-80 weight gear oil specific for motorcycles. And buy a Moose magnetic drain plug from your local dealer - you will surprised how much metal is floating around in your transmission even with regular oil changes. Check the new drain plug length against the stock one, you may need to use a washer as a spacer (I did on my CR250R 1979).

Don't sweat the pre-mix ratio. Use high-quality synthetic oil at a ratio between 32:1 and 40:1 (50:1 if you use Bel-Ray MC-1). These bikes are know to be a little difficult to jet and some of the guys here run 50% VP C-12 race gas to help with the pinging.

_________________
Michael Stiles
AHRMA, CalVMX and SVRG #190
Honda CR250R Elsinore 1979
Honda CR480R 1983
Honda CR250R 1987


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:46 am 
Got tired of waiting around so I sprayed starting fluid in the cylinder and kicked it over. It fired up on the third kick. I ran it for awhile and then oil started leaking out of the tailpipe. Everytime that I turned it off it started back up easily. Does this mean that the crank seals are gone? It leaked out a puddle on the swingarm. The power is the same though. Any ideas?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:10 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 10:20 pm
Posts: 185
Location: San Clemente, CA
If the bike idles at a constant speed on a steady throttle then I would guess you do not have an air leak, including at the crankcase seals. You may need to kick the bike over slowly before you try and start it to charge the cylinder. Cleaning out the carb would not be a bad idea just to make sure the pilot circuit is OK. The drool is normal. It is unburnt 2-stroke oil caused some by conservatively rich stock jetting, but mostly because it takes running the bike real hard to get the exhaust head pipe temp to the 1200 degrees needed to burn all the oil in the pre-mix.

_________________
Michael Stiles
AHRMA, CalVMX and SVRG #190
Honda CR250R Elsinore 1979
Honda CR480R 1983
Honda CR250R 1987


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:07 pm 
Sweet, I am just glad to have it back running again. I think that I am going to get a DG pipe for it once I get the carb cleaned out. Hopefully, this will have the motor evened out mod wise. The one that is on it has some dents in it and a pinhole around the front fender. I am getting ruts in the yard from this thing hitting the powerband in the same place. When it does hit, it yanks the front wheel off of the ground. I guess that means everything is running ok. I am def. going to use high octane gas from now on.


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